Conversions and Remakes

[Andarian]

We've been having some discussion about possible changes to our awards list for next year, and I thought it would be useful to poll the community regarding their views on remakes and conversions (such as PnP Conversion modules). Please feel free to post comments explaining your vote if you want!

[Tybae]

I voted other. I look at PnP conversions as just another module. I think the "they're ok" line doesn't really say it for me since I've played good PnP conversions and bad ones, but as they stand, I grade them on the same scale as other modules whether it be action, RP, Romance etc. If it is a PnP conversion of a module that I have played PnP, then I'll play it to see how the NWN module author adapted it to NWN and how well it works. I look at PnP conversions the same way as if I were to watch a movie based on a book. They are inspired by the original works but don't hold 100% true to the story. Some books don't translate well to movies at all because of limitations, bad script writing, bad directing, or maybe it was just a bad story to begin with. Some books don't have a really good story for a movie, but screenplay writers are able to expand on the story by using things that work in movies, case and point, The Dark Knight. Inspired by the comic books, but nowhere near 100% true to the comic, but the best movie I have seen all year and probably the best superhero movie I've ever seen. We all saw with the first round of Batman flicks that sometimes the extravagant villain doesn't go off very well in the movies. I couldn't stand any of the old Batman movies, except the first one. The later villains were just plain poorly done. Poison Ivy, Bane, Mr. Freeze, 2-Face, The Riddler, etc. The same can apply to PnP conversions to NWN. There are still limitations that you have telling that story. You're limited by scripting, items, areas, etc. Sometimes you need something that is an integral part of the story that isn't available in NWN through scripting, Custom Content, tilesets, etc. and sometimes there are things in the original PnP that just plain don't work for NWN. Now comes the human factor. When you play PnP, everything is up to adaptation by the DM, the way the players play their characters, etc. Things can change at any given moment, which is why I prefer to play old school PnP vs. NWN DM'd MP. The reason is because you're only limited by your imagination and the ability of the DM. I've had horrible DM's that I've actually walked out of a game session because I was so disgusted, went outside and lit my character sheet on fire and made sure the DM could see me do that. (Yes that's a true story. The character was created specifically for that campaign.) I've had others that I was depressed when we had to break up our sessions because the DM was so good. *swerves back on topic*

Now for the material released from previously produced material whether it be games, movies, books, etc. excluding PnP conversions. I would rate them on the same criteria that I would rate a PnP conversion on because, IMO, they follow the same guidelines.

All in all, I can't judge the modules based on previously released material by the source alone. There are too many variables when trying to judge them that way and it's really not fair to the module author, or the original piece, IMO. Personally, I think that sometimes people are far more critical of conversions than they are of regular modules especially when they already watched/read/played the original work. I look at them with an open mind and judge them on their own merit. Truth be told, sometimes I stay away from a PnP conversion because I already know the ending.

EDIT by Andarian: Restored origiinal message after inadvertently modifying it. (Sorry!) *Tybae* No worries.  I've done the same thing myself. 

Clarification:  I meant judging whether I like a module or not, not as an AME Member or in my GDA judging capacity. 

[Andarian]

I voted other.  I look at PnP conversions as just another module.  I think the "they're ok" line doesn't really say it for me since I've played good PnP conversions and bad ones, but as they stand, I grade them on the same scale as other modules whether it be action, RP, Romance etc.

This is really the view that I intended option 2 to represent, so I've edited the poll accordingly to remove the wording that you objected to.

Just to be clear, I'm mainly trying to get feedback on players' interest in conversions and remakes, rather than their evaluation of them. I think it goes without saying that each module has to be evaluated on its individual merits. But just as some players like to seek out, say, RP vs. Action mods (or vice versa), at least some players actively like and seek out things like PnP Conversion modules. Since I don't share it myself, I want to try to get a more objective sense of how widespread that sentiment is, rather than discount it because it's not my personal cup of tea.

[Tybae]

I voted other.  I look at PnP conversions as just another module.  I think the "they're ok" line doesn't really say it for me since I've played good PnP conversions and bad ones, but as they stand, I grade them on the same scale as other modules whether it be action, RP, Romance etc.

This is really the view that I intended option 2 to represent, so I've edited the poll accordingly to remove the wording that you objected to.

Much better.  In light of that, I have changed my vote to option 2.  Thanks Andarian! 

[Starlight]

I have a rather weak ties with DnD. I even play NWN without any PnP experience at all. (Though I have read the DnD manuals).

To me, they are just the same as long as the story is engaging and the adventure is fun.

[Skunkeen]

I enjoy being in the NWN Setting of the Forgotten Realms and to continue my roleplaying experience with in it DM or as a player and be near on the same page with other gamers as a social experience. Im sure others feel the same with other settings.
I do enjoy new creative settings sometimes when highly reviewed by others like the AME panel here or Vault or visiting PW's. Those are often one shots or short trilogies. But you never know how far they could advance outside of just being made for NWN. I would be very excited to see that happen for new setting creators with humble starts from their novel or NWN module.

When AME covers this topic its my most faved one to hear your news and interviews for cus I read alot of DND books. I like checking out the nominees eager to see if I can relate to their gaming background of games that inspired them. 

[sirchet]

When I look at the list of adventures available on the vault one of the deciding factors is that it's listed as a PnP conversion, kinda get a warm and fuzzy when I see an old favorite. This can often backfire on me due to poor implementation of the original module, the first Keep on The Borderlands is a fine example of this.

I feel the need to confess that your points on PnP staying a separate category have moved me to agree that perhaps we are spending valuable resources on a category that will and does fit in with best drama, (I think that's the new name).

I agree with Tybae, excellent DM's are few and far between... that's what makes them so special. An excellent PnP session, or multi-player session does not happen without a good DM, IMHO.

This brings up a point to think on, should we have a best DM award? (A thought for when we have many members).

In summation; I look for the PnP conversion listing and it means as much to me as the author, but not as much as the module description given by the author, this is why I voted "other".

*exits and bows to the statue of a DM*

[Starlight]

This brings up a point to think on, should we have a best DM award? (A thought for when we have many members).

I recall that there is a similar award held in NWC, which is something like "Hall of Fame for DM". I'm afraid it might duplicate with the existing one.

[Tybae]

This brings up a point to think on, should we have a best DM award? (A thought for when we have many members).

I recall that there is a similar award held in NWC, which is something like "Hall of Fame for DM". I'm afraid it might duplicate with the existing one.

Agreed. 

[Dragonstar]

With respect to Best DM, there are many who are unhappy with the way that the NWC  DM of the Year can come about, since there have been allegations of "ballot box stuffing" by some members over the past year.  It will be interesting to see what kind of outcry there is when the new DM of the Year is announced shortly. 

I suppose that Best DM can be addressed by AME if NWC ever ceased to exist.

[Tybae]

We're veering a little off topic.  Let's try to stick to posts that apply to the original question/poll.

[sirchet]

Been dieing to use this 

[Skunkeen]

With respect to Best DM, there are many who are unhappy with the way that the NWC  DM of the Year can come about, since there have been allegations of "ballot box stuffing" by some members over the past year.  It will be interesting to see what kind of outcry there is when the new DM of the Year is announced shortly. 

I suppose that Best DM can be addressed by AME if NWC ever ceased to exist.

I think I could of filled my nwc ballot box with more then 30 some if inclined. Now I am onto Other goals and projects for me to create more allegations.


I know off topic. call animal control.

[kookoo]

I don't really play much anymore, but I like remakes a lot.  I loved the snes of Eye of the Beholder and it was the first NWN module I played.  I also liked pool of radiance and If I ever get NWN2 that will be one of the first modules I play.  I also downloaded a bunch of the other remake modules when I first started downloading modules.  That said, I've come to really like the original modules out there better now.  There is more creativity, subjects that the old official modules of DnD couldn't broach because they get edited, and more role play in the community created modules.  So, I'm kinda both ways on it. 

My emo bunnies wave hi to all. 

[Eat2surf]

I look for PnP conversions.. I still own a lot of those old mods and love seeing them crunched into the computer... As a builder.. taking an NWN1 mod and converting it to NWN2 is a totally different thing than taking the PnP mod and converting it to NWN1 or 2.. I think Best PnP conversion should remain a category if only to encourage more of them... I understand the workload problem.. I dunno.. I got into NWN because of the promise of PnP conversions... I hope the category doesn't go away.. but I also understand how late I am to the party.

Edit: voted Other.. because I actively search out PnP modules.. but I don't really seek out conversions of existing NWN mods.